Patience is key in photography and I had to learn that really quickly when I started photography because especially with wildlife photography. these creatures can be really shy, so you have to wait and pretty much be like a bush and just wait for the animal to come to you because then you get its natural behaviours and it's not that frightened of you. Hello and welcome to the SheClicks Women in Photography Podcast. I'm Angela Nicholson and I'm the founder of SheClicks, which is a community for female photographers. In these podcasts, I talk to women in the photographic industry to hear about their experiences, what drives them and how they got to where they are now. Today our guest is Jamie Smart, a 10 year old wildlife photographer who already has an impressive list of awards to her name. Hi, Jamie, thank you so much for joining me on the SheClicks Women in Photography Podcast today. It's great to have the opportunity to chat with you. It's lovely to chat with you too. Thank you. So why photography? What do you love about it? I think, well, wildlife always came first and then photography, but I think I just love using it to help me identify creatures that I see and also show people how amazing wildlife is. Because, especially with bugs I find as well when I'm doing my macro photography, you get to see details that you never get to see with the naked eye, like lenses on the eyes and everything. And it gets to show people this new world of insects and all the other creatures that we have around us. So how did you move on from taking record shots that where you're using them to go back and maybe look up and find out what that insect is or what that bird is to taking more impactful images that you want to, say maybe print, put on the wall or send to a competition? I'd say it did start just going around the garden and I've always used manual so it was just getting used to using the apertures and the shutter speeds and then I was starting to learn more about lighting and how photography really worked and then that helped me to improve in my photography. When you say you've been learning, how have you done that learning? Well, it started off with Dad teaching me what he knew because you always had photography as a hobby. And then I was just looking up stuff on the internet and I also did a course diploma in photography by a studio photographer and landscape photographer called Carl Taylor and he really did teach me a lot about how lighting works. So those were the main things that I'm learning about and I'm still learning about it today. I think we all are. That's one of the great things about photography and wildlife actually is that you can continually learn and that's really a rewarding process. Aww definitely, especially with wildlife I find because there's so many species out there we still haven't discovered or things we don't know and there's so much to still learn about them. So yeah, it's definitely a never ending process of learning. And do you remember the very first picture that you took? Actually, my first picture wasn't really of wildlife. I think it was actually of a little clay model around the house, just so I was getting used to how to use a camera. But then I was getting pictures of sparrows in the bushes, mainly things around the garden at that point in time. But the picture that stands out for me at that point in time was just a couple of weeks after I started photography. A peregrine falcon flew over our house. and I managed to capture it in flight while it was flying over our house. And I remember that mum and dad were like, can't be a peregrine falcon, there aren't any here. And then we put it into Lightroom, brought up the shadows and saw the barring and found out it was actually a peregrine. How amazing! That's quite a tricky shot to get as well because you have to spot it quickly, get it in the viewfinder, get it in the frame, get the fast shutter speed and try and get it in focus. Yep, definitely. It was a very fast bird as it flew over. I saw it sort of coming, so I had to quickly get it before it had a bum shot of it flying away. I think every wildlife photographer's got a few bum shots of a bird. I think they're quite important. Absolutely. Yes, I mean, we met at the Comedy Wildlife Photography Awards and there's some very funny shots that people didn't set out to take, but they're real winners. Yeah, it was quite interesting to see all the images that people have captured. Yeah, when you first started photography, I think you used your dad's D500 didn't you? Nikon D500. But you now use a Nikon Z9. What made you choose that? Well, it was just the better quality in that body. So I did start with the D500 and then I moved up to the D850. And then I was saving up to get the Z9 because it was a really good body. It's pretty light. It's really robust as well from when I started using it. I've been taking it to its limits almost from... really warm conditions to cold ones, rain or shine and it still worked. It's been a really good body. Yeah. What would you say is your favourite feature about it? Oof, I'm not sure. mean, all the features on any camera are quite important, including the aperture, shutter speed, and of course, you need the shutter button as well to get the images. But I'd say I don't have a favorite because they all come in handy in different situations. I thought you might say the subject recognition on the Z9, because its ability to, yeah, yeah. I mean, to be able to get the eyes of a bird in focus while you're busy composing is really useful, isn't it? Yes, definitely, especially if you're photographing an animal that's quite quick or small and hard to spot. The subject detection can help with that as well. Now I was interested that you said the Z9 is quite light because I know a lot of SheClickers would not consider that to be a light camera. So what's your top tip for holding it steady? I'd say that holding it steady really, you've just got to get used to the weight of it and what lens you're using as well. And I'd say another great thing about the Z9 is also because it has a silent shutter, it doesn't make a sound. So it's really handy for wildlife photography because the animals can't hear you. I remember when I started with the D850 and the D500, as soon as I got like two pictures, it looked and they went. watch that, and then ran away because it didn't like the sound coming out of the camera. But I say it's just getting used to how the camera works. Mm-hmm. And finding a balance for it. Do you ever use a monopod or a tripod? I do sometimes, but not always because I don't actually find it that easy to use a tripod or a monopod. I actually quite, I prefer to use handheld because you can track a subject quicker. But with some things, of course, you need to use a tripod if it's quite dark or you're trying to do a stack with a bug or something, or if you're doing studio photography because you need the tripod to keep everything steady. em So it does depend what I'm photographing, really I don't tend to use it. Okay, and where would you say is your favorite place for photography? Whew, that's hard because there's a lot of places I like to go to to photograph wildlife that's on the bucket list, but I can't at the moment. Let's tackle the bucket list next. Say where you've been that you really like going. Oof, well we did just come back from Scotland which was really special because we got to see some amazing creatures. The landscapes were unbelievable and it was just an amazing place to photograph and there's so many different things that you can photograph up there. I'd also say that the opportunity that I had to go to Australia was really special because I love rainforests and photographing insects. and I'd say that my macro passion really kicked off from going to Australia because the bugs out there are crazy. Some have these weird things coming out of their body, antenna like two meters long. It's crazy creatures out there, but really special. So not so much macro then. I do quite like a bit of macro, yes, but I love doing all photography. I like trying lots of different things and new things and trying things out. But I'd say at the moment, my passion for bugs is quite high. Mm-hmm. Fantastic. And so you said you mentioned you've got a bucket list. What are, say, the top three places on your bucket list? That is hard because I'd like to go anywhere and everywhere to photograph different wildlife. But I would like to try and visit more rainforests, maybe places like Peru and Panama. But I'd also like to go to the colder regions as well, the Arctic Circle and the Antarctic to photograph all the different creatures that are there as well. So at the moment I'd say those are some of the top ones on the list. Oh, fabulous. It's interesting because quite a lot of photographers really get into the sort of Arctic, Antarctic wildlife photography and it's, know, obviously you need a lot of clothes, a lot of special equipment, but it really seems to appeal and you're one of the few that's actually mentioned a rainforest. oh I'd say I do actually quite like rainforest, but I like all regions so it is hard for me to pick Do you really enjoy editing photos as well or would you say that's just something you have to do? I do quite enjoy it sometimes, yes, because you get to tweak little bits that are on your image to make it look a bit better, but I try to do most of my stuff in camera and try to get the best image I can out of the situation I'm in. And then I will do the bits that might need to be done in post then. But I'd say I try to do most of it in camera and then you sort of see it come to life just that little bit more when you put it into whatever you're using to do editing. Please excuse this interruption. This episode is supported by Nikon, a world leading provider of imaging products and services. Nikon's regional director, Charlotte Kelmsley says, at Nikon, we pride ourselves on empowering photographers to create images and videos that inspire. We are honored to be partnering with SheClicks and share their ambition of increasing the visibility of women in all aspects of photography. Okay, let's get back to the show. And you've had a lot of success in photography competitions over the last few years. I was looking on your website and your list of awards for 2025 is very, very impressive. So congratulations on that. Do you enjoy entering competitions? It looks like you do. I definitely do because you never know, you might get something you might not, but I'd say it is most about, it is not all about the experience, but it's how you took the image and everything because that story really shines to you. And then I'd say the cherry on top is to maybe get something, even a highly commended in a competition, because you just get that little bit more of like, yes, because it's actually got something. It's just really special when you're able to go to these competitions. Do you think about the competition when you're shooting or you just go out shooting and then you see the competition like, that picture would look great. That would work for that competition. Yeah, I don't really think about the competition when I'm doing my photography. I just think about getting the best image I can in what situation I'm in. And then if I look on the back of the camera, you can sort of see when it's going to be a good image because you're like, can, when you go through them, you can go, that's the one. And then you can enter into a competition and see what happens and fingers crossed you get something. But I don't really think about the competitions when I'm doing photography. Does your dad help you pick the pictures that you went for the competition or is it all yours? All your choice? Mm-hmm. and pick the pictures because I have quite a few pictures that I've taken over the four years that I've done photography now. But yeah, we always sometimes get different folders that we put the favourite images out of the short list that we've done. And we all do it without each other seeing, so then we can go and if we've... both selected one image then it will definitely go in. If we haven't then we'll try and get the correct amount of images into the competition. But yeah, it's all a team effort. Yeah. Have you ever overruled your dad on a picture and said, no, no, I really want this one in? I don't think so. think we have similar opinions on images. But I'd say it's really important though if he sees something and he's like maybe try this or if I see something and I want to try and do that angle or something. So it's all about just doing a team effort and you will get the image in the end. I think that is one of the most addictive parts of wildlife photography in particular. You like you said, your shot that you've got of the peregrine falcon, I bet after you just had that for a little while, think, oh, maybe if I could get one from this angle or maybe I can get it doing this. And you start to search for perfecting your pictures even more, don't you? Yes, and I'd say if you have found a new passion for the creature that you're photographing as well, you want to learn more about it because when you learn more about it and understand your subject, you're able to capture a better picture of it because you know, you roughly know what it might do. So I'd say, yeah, with a peregrine because we actually found out that it flew over fairly often. If I did see it before it left because it was really fast, I was trying to get different images of it, yeah. Yeah, that's really important, that understanding of wildlife. So like you say, you know roughly what time it might fly over or you know where it likes to nest or you can see it's feeding habits so you know where to go and look for it. Oh yes, I'd say knowing about your subject is key in photography because then you can learn what it eats, what habitat it likes, where it might be, when it might be, what time it comes out to hunt, if it's only found in one specific area, when you might want to go there, what's the best time of year, and all of that information piled on top of each other can really help in getting a good image in your subject. So I know this is probably gonna change from week to week, but right at the moment, what is your favorite subject to photograph? Yeah. photographing all different species of wildlife. But I'd say bugs are quite high. I've also been trying to get some more pictures of the birds that are in the garden because every year we have siskins and redpoles that come to visit and they've just come back into the garden. So I'm trying to get some better pictures of them this year. But it's really hard because every... um animal that I get a picture of has a different character and you can sometimes really see it in an image. If you're photographing, I don't know, a coal tit you can sort of see its flight pattern and when it's going to come back and you can change your angle for it and you can see if there's like a robin that's really bossy and doesn't let any of the bird on the feeder when it's there. So you get to learn a lot about the creatures. So it's really hard to choose but I'd say bugs and birds are up there at the moment. Any specific type of bug or bird? I'd say, well I do love weevils and I do love bees for bugs. But they come out a bit later on when you have the flowers coming out for spring. So you've gotta wait a little bit longer to get better macromages because that's when the bugs really shine. But with the birds, I do love hornbills but they're not found in Britain. No, you're not going to get one on your bird feeder. new. I think I saw, I forget what they're called now, a tree creeper this morning, which I haven't seen for a long time. Yeah, which was really nice. I couldn't see it very well. It was on next door's roof, but I'm pretty sure it was one, so I'll be keeping my eyes open for that. Yeah, definitely. Tree creepers are lovely species of bird and they're really cute as well going up the trees. It looks like a little lump is just really slowly climbing up the tree and then flies to a different one. It's really cute. We spoke about your success and all the pictures, you know, have been awarded, had all sorts of awards, but do you have a favourite image that you've captured or one that you're most proud of? It's hard because I love all the images that I take and I feel that every image for me has a story behind it and as soon as I look at it I can go, yeah, that's, I can remember what happened when I took it. I do say I've got to love the spider image because the spider and the stag and the grasshopper, they were the three in the top 100 in the Wildlife Photographer of the Year. which was really special for me because it's been a goal of mine to just get a highly commended in that competition. So to be able to win the category and have two highly commended was just so special. I'd say they have to be up there at the moment. I've also loved photographing all sorts of different animals, especially when we were in Scotland, I got to photograph another animal that was been on the bucket list for ages, which was eagles, otters and crested tits, along with snow hares. I did want to try and find a ptarmigan but they are so hard to find. They literally blend in and as soon as any person's there, they go straight up to where there's no people and you never see them again. So it's really hard to find them and they're still on the bucket list. It sounds like you had a very productive time in Scotland though. yeah, it was amazing. It was definitely a time of a lifetime and something that has been on my bucket list for ages. So to finally tick it off is just amazing. Fantastic. Do you have any advice for other girls or women looking to get into photography? You know, picking up a camera for the first time, what would be your top tip for them? I'd say definitely understanding your subject is key. Also learning about lighting and how photography works is definitely something that is quite important to photography because light is key. I'd also say just, so yeah, understanding your subject, learning about the lighting and patience. Patience is key in photography and I had to learn that really quickly when I started photography because especially with wildlife photography. these creatures can be really shy, so you have to wait and pretty much be like a bush and just wait for the animal to come to you because then you get its natural behaviours and it's not that frightened of you. Yeah, that's a good point because you could sit there for hours and if you get really bored and start huffing and puffing the animal that was getting close is gonna go, isn't it? Yeah, it could easily go, especially if it's something really shy. Yeah well let's go to Six from SheClicks. I've got 10 questions from SheClickers and I would like you to answer six questions please by picking numbers from one to ten. So if you could give me your first number please, we'll get rolling. Okay, let's try number... Oof, 10. Let's try number 10. 10. Okay, this is a good one. Do you have, this was asked by several people actually, do you have any photographer, heroes or heroines? oh I definitely have a couple of people. mean, one of my top idols is definitely Bertie Gregory, who's a wildlife photographer and filmmaker and really good at what he does. He also presents his own films as well, which is amazing. People like David Attenborough, other people I've been following since I was four, like Robert Fuller, they have always been my idols and they still are and I still look up to them. I think they're amazing people. Ahh fantastic, well I hope you get to meet some of them. Okay, I have your second number please? Ooh, try number four. Number four, are you working on any long-term photography projects at the moment? That question's from Louise. Oh, um... Not sure. I don't... don't think it's any long term photography. Obviously going to Scotland has been something that's been on the bucket list for a while, so that could be something for long term photography for the bucket list. But I'd say just going out and seeing what I can find is one of the main things that I do, because I used to go out and say, I'm gonna try and find this particular species, and then you never usually find that species, but you find about 15 others. And it was still an amazing day, even though you didn't see that species. So I don't go out with expectations of seeing a particular species. I go out to see what I can try and find. And if I find it, that's the cherry on top. Yeah, I think that's a really good attitude. Right, can I have your third number, please? Ooh, let's try number six. Okay, what is the most surprising thing an animal has done while you were photographing it? That question's from Carmen. I'd say actually one of the quite interesting things an animal did, when we were in Scotland, we were photographing some otters and this one actually came out onto the seaweed that was on the shore and it was quite funny because the cameraman that was with us... he actually went down to a rock to get a little closer to the otter without spooking it and he didn't know it was gonna come on the land at that point. And then it actually ran towards him, jumped on the rock, saw him, went, And then jumped down and actually sprinted right next to him. So he went to the toilet right next to him which was quite funny to watch. um But yeah, that has to be one of the interesting moments an animal has done. Yeah that's quite a funny reaction. Great. Okay, could I have your fourth number please? Okay, let's try number one. Number one, how long are you prepared to wait for the shot? Have you ever waited ages and then missed it? That question's from Anne. I'd say that the longest I've probably waited to get an image was two days when I was photographing with a wildlife photographer called Danny Green because it was the prize for winning the overall for the RSPCA Young Photographer Awards. And it was to photograph red deer for two days at Bradgate Park. So it took, it was from pretty much from dawn to dusk, we were out photographing these deer in the rutting season. when the sun was just going below the hill. And that was really special. And actually one of the images that I captured on that was the highly commended in the wildlife photographer of the year. So yeah, it did take a couple of days to be able to capture that image, but it was really special. Yes, good, so you didn't miss it, that's great. Okay, can I have your fifth number please? Alright, let's try number two Okay, when you go out photographing do you usually have a plan of what to shoot or do see what you discover? Now you mentioned this you said you go you used to go out with a plan but now you've changed. What made you change your mind? I say it's just because you never know what you are going to see. So you could, of course, when you learn about a particular species and you find that it can be found there, you go to try and capture it. But you could find other species along with it. So I just went out to see what I could find and hoped that I could find the species that I was after. But if I couldn't, I'd try another day. So I'd say it was just because I wasn't sure what I was going to find because you never know what might turn up. Yes, I mean you've got to go to the right area. If you think, I'm going to photograph herons, you don't usually go to, I don't know, you know, a park with no pond or anything, do you? You go to somewhere with a pond or a river. So you're kind of like setting yourself in the right direction, but then you might not see a heron. You might see something else. Now, your dad is a photographer. we discussed, who gets to decide where you go? Obviously, he's the driver. the driver and sometimes the caddy as uh well. yep, definitely. But I'd say if I want to try and capture something, we try to do the best that we can to find the place that is good to try and find that species. So for example, if I wanted to try and photograph a red grouse, we try and go to a moorland where we know that there's wild. red grouse that are found and then you've just got to try and find them and hope that they might be there. So I'd say that it is, it's just a team, it's a team effort again to try and find the correct areas. And dad also does video of me while I'm doing it, while I'm doing my photography as well. And he's sort of given up on photography and he just films me and sometimes the animal. What's the funny thing is that when he flicks over to video to try and capture the animal, it usually runs away. It's like it knows and then it goes, ha, you're not getting me. But yeah, he mainly does video of me. Okay, all right so it's your last number Oh, okay, let's try number eight. Number eight, has photography success changed your day-to-day life? That question's from Marie-Ange. I'd say it has actually because the calendar has definitely become more full. It's become, it's definitely had more things booked in it than ever before. But I just love it because I get to talk to amazing people like yourself and talk about my passion which is wildlife and photography. So I'd say my life has changed in doing photography but it wasn't a bad thing, it was always a good thing. Ahh that's good. So you basically get to talk a lot more about photography and do more photography now. I'd say so. I'd say the photography actually. I've talked a lot more about photography this year than I have actually done photography. But I said when we went to Scotland, that list is, the levels have actually gone back to the equal amount now. But yeah, when I can, I try and do photography. And when the light's good, of course, because you never know in Britain, the light could be awful or could be rainy like it is almost every day. But when I can I try and do some photography and I just love talking about wildlife and photography as well. that's great. I understand that feeling when you suddenly think, hang on, I haven't taken a photograph for ages. I've been talking about photography and it is so nice to go out for a day or maybe a bit longer, you know, go away with some friends, go away with your family and just concentrating, taking some photographs. It's really nice, isn't it? Even just going around the garden to photograph what you can find. I'd say, I know that I started doing photography with birds and I haven't actually done many pictures of the garden birds in the garden for a while. So I've tried to do some more now and I've really enjoyed it because I get to see their characters come back to life and it's lovely. Yes. Do you have any individuals that you feel you've got to know? I've definitely got to know the coal tits that are in the garden, especially the robins because they are really territorial. You know their patch because if there's any other robin that goes to the feeder, that robin is soon going to leave to its own territory because that one robin is not happy about it being there. I'd also say we actually have discovered that the long-tailed tits are regular visitors to the feeders in the mornings, so it's really lovely to see them because they're so cute. I call them lollipop birds because they literally just look like a ball of fluff and then a long tail. It's so cute. But yeah, yeah, definitely. But I say I've got to learn more about them. And we've also discovered that we have one marsh tit or willow tit, it's hard to tell the difference, in the garden. So I've got to learn his sort of pattern and when he likes to visit as well. Oh fabulous. Well, Jamie, thank you so much for joining me on the Podcast. It's been really lovely chatting with you. it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much for letting me come on. You're very welcome. Thank you. Bye bye. See ya! Thanks for joining me for this episode of the She Clicks Women in Photography Podcast. I hope you enjoyed it. Special thanks to everyone who sent in a question. You'll find links to Jamie's website and social media channels in the show notes. I'll be back with another episode soon, so please subscribe to the show and tell all your friends and followers about it. In the meantime, enjoy your photography.